The Gathering

forum
It is currently 25 Apr 2024, 19:06

All times are UTC + 1 hour




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 142 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2007, 00:32 
Offline
moderator
moderator
User avatar

Joined: 15 Jul 2002, 01:00
Posts: 23851
Location: Holy John Ready, Greece
Abbath wrote:
Wow... this has been one of the most interesting posts Ive ever read in the forum.


Really really thanks for sharing all this inside information with the fans! :flower:

_________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHMXXFG_McI
Soundgaze.gr - Fix Your Gaze On Music
Το Πολυμίξερ της Μουσικής


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2007, 08:22 
Offline
Always
Always
User avatar

Joined: 15 Dec 2002, 22:06
Posts: 6465
Location: Lyon, France
Wow! Exactly. What a post!

^^


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2007, 10:38 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 28 Sep 2002, 09:24
Posts: 101
Location: Next door to that other neighbor of yours who always gives strange looks but never says anything...
Thanks Han!
That's quite a story- I really didn't mind it's long-windedness, being that is was so clear & articulate.

I think that I feel the same about TG's production- like with "if_then_else"'s compressed sound that you talk about, even though it was so great to finally hear "orchestration" with real horns and strings, just something about that particular album never did it for me; it's got some great songs, but the album as a whole still somehow feels like an EP to me.

I agree completely about HTMAP- over 8 years later, it's still an interesting listen, even still I tend to hear something deep in the mix that I didn't catch before. Even vocal-wise - I remember before that album's release, when I used to listen to the first two "Anneke albums", I kind of yearned to hear her sing a little more tempered and not always so high up in the register- apparently the band felt the same way on HTMAP, because that's what happened :)

The "Home" album really grew on me- and I kinda think that the sound on that album is something close to "the sound they need" as you described. It's probably their least "layered" album, but the vibe and feeling is very natural. You should check that one out if you get a chance.

Anyway I could go on and on, and I suppose that's a whole different subject :p
I'm just as curious about that early material as the rest of us, and I hope that you and Hans can sort of bury the hatchet somehow, whether those tapes finally see the light of day or not.

Peace-out,
Jeff


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2007, 11:47 
Offline
Second sunrise
Second sunrise

Joined: 13 Oct 2002, 00:15
Posts: 30
Location: Stedebroec
Thanks guys, I really appriciate it. Let me tell you something about recording, in the early nineties there wasn't anything more than analog recording. Digital recording came a little later and ten years later almost every studio is recording digitally. The sound isn't exactly the same, but close and digital has it's convenience, is much cheaper (a reel of two inch tape costs $300 and contains 32 minutes of music at 15 inch per second, thus 16 minutes at 30 ips).

In a digital workstation like ProTools one can make many more tracks than the 24 of an analog machine and editing is a piece of cake. And there are plugins like beat detective and soundreplacer. Beat detective can make every crappy drummer sound like a hero and sound replacer replaces all drumsounds for samples.

This may sound like God, but in fact is the devil and imagine a drummer like Hans, with his unique own style of drumming. Imagine Hans' drumming being quantised within 1/1000th of a second an his typical own sound being replaced bij samples of Metallica, can you imagine that?

This is the modern art of recording, music being less important than technique, which I personally hate.

The Gathering is a band that has it's strength because of playing together and so creating it's unique soundscape, this cannot be done bij computer, only by humans.

About the sound: in my former post I've put a hyperlink to something we call 'loudness war'. http://www.mindspring.com/~mrichter/dyn ... namics.htm

We, as a community of engineers are complaining about this for more than 10 years now on forums like gearslutz and prosoundweb, but we actually have lost this war a long time ago. What's happening, imagine you play yer CD after 'Californication' by Red Hot Cili Peppers and yer CD sound a lot better, with more dimension, but half as loud as RHCP.
You don't want hat do you? so you ask the mastering engineer to make it sound louder.

But in digital there is an absolute maximum, lets call it zero. A CD can have a dynamic range of more than 90dB, which is fantastic, but I've been listening to CD's that have a dynamic range of less than 1 dB, one single deciBell.

Let's take Hans' drumming for an example, if you record this it will have a gigantic dynamic range. Cymbal hits will reach zero, but the dynamics will be within more than 20/25 dB. Now add the guitars, bass, keyboards and vocals and mix this. It will still have a huge dynamic range, but the peaks (transients) will reach the maximum of zero dB. You can't go any louder because the convertors won't be able to recreate the original sound waves and it will end up as crackle and nasty sounding distortion.

Okay, we don't wat that so we won't make any 'overs' and the mix will sound great, an open sound with lost of dynamics, lots of space, deepness and width, a so called three dimensional sound.

But it'll sound not as loud as RHCP, so what we can do is compress it, push the overall level towards zero and if we do this with care it will still sound great. You can see this in the link I've put here. But there comes a point where we go too far or much too far, where dynamics gets lost completely and the sound ends up as flat and lifeless. Look at the link and you'll see what I mean.

Almost a Dance was made before the loudness war started and it was recorded with hi end gear, so it sounds great in my humble opinion. If you put a song of AaD in your editor like Adobe Audition, Cubase, Nuendo, ProTools, Logic, Sonar or whatever and put a maximizer plugin on it, push the level and it will sound loud, louder and loudest, but also flat, more flat and most flat and most of all lifeless, which we don't want, do we?

Sorry for the long rant.

Peace, han


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2007, 13:14 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 02 Sep 2006, 11:02
Posts: 64
Hello Han, it's very interesting what you're saying. I've got a micro home studio and i personally record my band's stuff. I'm not a sound engineer, but i'm trying to learn something about recording and mastering.
I know what you said about the loudness: today it's difficult to find (expecially here in south Italy) a good studio with analog instruments, everuthing's made with Cubase, Nuendo, Sound Forge ecc ecc and everyone needs "more compression, more loudness" on songs; drums are often played with pads and then quantized "fpr a better and clean sound"... I HATE this!!! I play drums, and i record my own drumkit with two condenser 'cause i like hums, little crackles and natural reverbs.
Unfortunately i'm not from Hilton family, i can't buy analog compressors, spectrum analysers or everything else, so i have to work with Cubase and Ableton Live 6. But a computer will never give the real hot and live sound to a song.

_________________
http://www.myspace.com/deafeningacousticsilence

http://www.myspace.com/shoeskillinworm

http://www.myspace.com/hamamusic

http://www.myspace.com/screamingflowersband

http://www.myspace.com/genecrazed


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2007, 13:53 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 02 Sep 2006, 11:02
Posts: 64
Han wrote:
What's happening, imagine you play yer CD after 'Californication' by Red Hot Cili Peppers and yer CD sound a lot better, with more dimension, but half as loud as RHCP.
You don't want hat do you? so you ask the mastering engineer to make it sound louder.


I don't like the "Californicaton" sound: it's too too too squeezed, expecially drums: TOTALLY FLAT!!!!!!! It seems there wasn't Chad Smith behind drumkit, it seems played with Battery!!! :-? :-? :-?

Do you know "Evil Empire" from Rage Against The Machine? I love it!!!!! It's so warm, dynamic, real... it sounds GREAT!!!

_________________
http://www.myspace.com/deafeningacousticsilence

http://www.myspace.com/shoeskillinworm

http://www.myspace.com/hamamusic

http://www.myspace.com/screamingflowersband

http://www.myspace.com/genecrazed


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 13 Jul 2007, 06:19 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 28 Sep 2002, 09:24
Posts: 101
Location: Next door to that other neighbor of yours who always gives strange looks but never says anything...
still nothing... :(

Since this was announced all those months back, I wrote to Vic Records a couple of times, saying that I was looking forward to Downfall and asking if there is any status of a possible release date- they were professional enough to ignore my e-mail both times :-?

Maybe something will get rolling before the end of the year, though- with stuff like the Nighttimbe Birds re-release and A Noise Severe dvd/cd coming out soon, maybe it's possible people will be inspired to jump on the wagon and release some more material from the Gathering archives.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 22 Jul 2007, 14:57 
Offline
King for a day
King for a day

Joined: 19 Oct 2004, 20:50
Posts: 903
Location: Havana on the Waal
Been wondering about Vic Records too. They've been announcing the release of several excellent Russian pagan metal albums in The Netherlands, but it's been months and still nothing. Perhaps they aren't as professional as they seem to be?

_________________
You know all roses should be white.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 23 Sep 2007, 18:06 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 28 Sep 2002, 09:24
Posts: 101
Location: Next door to that other neighbor of yours who always gives strange looks but never says anything...
I just remembered this topic the other day, and thought I should pass along an e-mail that I finally received from Vic records a few weeks back...

Re: The Gathering - Downfall‏
From: roel van reijmersdal | vic records (info@vicrecords.com)
Sent: Tue 9/04/07 8:10 AM
Hey,
well, no release dates settled yet. But that cd will be released for SURE! This veriosn wil blow you away, 7 new and toatlly unreleased tracks will beon it, totally different the the HAmmerHeart vesions form some years ago.Your supprt is VERY much appreciated. PLease keep an eye on our website andmyspace page....Within some months we will start! And then there is no wayback:)


Encouraging, but still no release date...
Anyway I figured that's sorta some "news" :)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 27 Sep 2007, 23:31 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 28 Sep 2002, 09:24
Posts: 101
Location: Next door to that other neighbor of yours who always gives strange looks but never says anything...
Hmmm. rabid interest in this topic, eh? :P


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 28 Sep 2007, 07:28 
Offline
Traveller
Traveller
User avatar

Joined: 22 Dec 2001, 01:00
Posts: 307
Location: this bloody earth (land of poppied fields)
Yep, don't think you're the only "when they were death/doom" fan around.
It sounds quite alluring the stuff about different material from Hammerheart edition.
I'm also waiting for old katatonia, avantgarde-times reissues.
October Tide, Rain Without End among others.



Ps: f*ck need to sleep.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2008, 21:01 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 28 Sep 2002, 09:24
Posts: 101
Location: Next door to that other neighbor of yours who always gives strange looks but never says anything...
So it sounds like this thing is finally on it's way, according to Hans' update today.
Sometime in the Spring...

Some events that have happened to me recently have placed my mind and course of life in such a different place from the dreams I used to have back in the days when this topic originally came about...
I don't really care about much anymore...
but I still love this band and I'm sure I will still want to check this stuff out.

Jeff


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2008, 21:34 
Offline
Traveller
Traveller
User avatar

Joined: 22 Dec 2001, 01:00
Posts: 307
Location: this bloody earth (land of poppied fields)
well good news about this bitch coming out anytime soon.
I was wondering about the track list of the demo 92', I can't figure out the song titles of number 4 & 6...

@Jeff, cheer up, man you sound quite down, well whatever it is what happened to you, hope you get over it and be alright again.

greetings

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 03 Feb 2008, 00:52 
Offline
Traveller
Traveller
User avatar

Joined: 17 Dec 2006, 00:08
Posts: 315
Location: Rotterdam, Holland
Im really curious about Bart singin the Almost a Dance songs, maybe now I will start listening to them. Though I must say that every now and than I force myself into listening a song from AaD and I'm really starting to like some songs, especially Heartbeat amplifier.

_________________
Op mijn manier.....


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 06 Feb 2008, 02:34 
Offline
Traveller
Traveller
User avatar

Joined: 22 Dec 2001, 01:00
Posts: 307
Location: this bloody earth (land of poppied fields)
the guitar riff in that song specially is very catchy, it should be redone, for the next the Gathering album, let's start the petition to the band right now :green:

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2008, 01:17 
Offline
Traveller
Traveller
User avatar

Joined: 17 Dec 2006, 00:08
Posts: 315
Location: Rotterdam, Holland
I wonder if Marieke is on the AaD demos!

_________________
Op mijn manier.....


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2008, 01:41 
Offline
moderator
moderator
User avatar

Joined: 12 Oct 2001, 01:00
Posts: 6683
Location: Deventer!!! [NL]
Probably not as she was only guest singer on Always... cause she was doing som recording of her own when TG were recording Always...

_________________
Maybe i'm paranoid, yeah that's my problem
You almost have to be when you look like me


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2008, 15:24 
Offline
Traveller
Traveller
User avatar

Joined: 17 Dec 2006, 00:08
Posts: 315
Location: Rotterdam, Holland
So probably no female vocals??

_________________
Op mijn manier.....


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2008, 15:52 
Offline
moderator
moderator
User avatar

Joined: 12 Oct 2001, 01:00
Posts: 6683
Location: Deventer!!! [NL]
I dont know... everything of that time is not that well known in the fan community anyway...

_________________
Maybe i'm paranoid, yeah that's my problem
You almost have to be when you look like me


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: 08 Apr 2008, 06:00 
Offline
Third chance
Third chance

Joined: 28 Sep 2002, 09:24
Posts: 101
Location: Next door to that other neighbor of yours who always gives strange looks but never says anything...
So, any word yet on a release date? :)

Looks like this might be quite a bit shorter than the ambitious original that was planned a couple years ago...
Wasn't it originally going to be 2 cd's along with another 2 dvd set, or so?

Still looking forward to it :)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 142 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group