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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 20 Feb 2009, 21:40 
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Dutch wrote:
So when you listen to Tool it reminds you many different things,right?

Because when i listen to Tool it doesnt remind me of anything else.
And you will understand from the first second what you are listening to

You're talking to a guy who owns every single one of Tool's albums (including their videos and demos) and has listened to their albums from start to finish numerous times. I know Tool very well. I didn't say they weren't unique, that's not the point. The point I'm trying to make is that you're making up your own rules for genres and recommending things to people. Just because wikipedia says so doesn't make it true. They're the ones saying nu-metal is a subgenre of metal, when really nu-metal has its roots in post grunge, which is completely ridiculous (obviously) because post grunge has nothing at all to do with metal. Two totally different movements. They're also the same people calling people like Mike Patton avant garde metal. What the hell? Avant garde is a genre all on its own. It involves experimentation of multiple genres. Nothing less, nothing more. Please do not spread wikipedia's falsehoods and save everyone the hassle.


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 21 Feb 2009, 17:44 
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The difference with the "label" "progressive" is that you cant call progressive something which doesnt brings any progress. If you are playing the same style in 5 records you cannot be called progressive. Technical may be ,but not progressive

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 21 Feb 2009, 18:50 
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can we just return to bashing DT's last 5 years of existence :green:

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 21 Feb 2009, 19:02 
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It's ok with me...or maybe we could say how much progressive Ulver is!

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2009, 00:40 
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in the right thread then ;) Ulver is avant garde, not prog...

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2009, 11:16 
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Dutch wrote:
The difference with the "label" "progressive" is that you cant call progressive something which doesnt brings any progress. If you are playing the same style in 5 records you cannot be called progressive. Technical may be ,but not progressive

You're speaking more in a general manner. Please do not confuse the genre any more than it has been. And someone's gotta worry, otherwise things get twisted and people get lazy to the point where it doesn't make any sense anymore. Ulver is post black metal, if i recall correctly, along with Arcturus. Avant-garde is more like Fantomas, uneXpect, Estradasphere, Mr. Bungle, Secret Chiefs 3, Naked City and so on..


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2009, 13:15 
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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2009, 19:20 
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@rmf919: blah di blah di blah... you only try to defines genre... whiel I was speaking about how I feel the things :green:

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2009, 20:40 
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I don't mean to sound like I'm stirring up shit here but as music fan, it gets kind of irritating seeing these genres get misconstrued and then passed on. That'd be kinda like me going around telling people you we're an N'sync fan, which is probably not true. I don't like to make a habit of going around saying things that I'm not sure of.


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2009, 13:27 
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Burn wrote:
can we just return to bashing DT's last 5 years of existence :green:


No!! :green:

I'm a fan of DT since I stumbled upon their debut album in 1989. Sure, the last five years weren't the best in DT-history, but they still write songs other bands would kill for. Call it progressive, call it technical - who cares? For me, DT are progressive heavy metal (in this case, "progressive" means that they don't sound like Hammerfall :wink: ). Especially the latest output, "Systematic Chaos" is more metal than ever. I like the "thrash-style" of some tracks.

Real progressive music (in my ears) sounds different. It sounds like Radiohead, Björk, Godspeed You! Black Emperor, Psychotic Waltz on their first two albums, The Gathering after "Nighttime Birds"...


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2009, 16:15 
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Hammerfall have song that other band would kill to have (or may be hail and kill to have)

Dream Theater dont sound like hammerfall but in systematic chaos sound a bit like Anthrax

According to rmf919,the bands you mentioned above arent progressive(maybe only psychotic waltz)

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2009, 20:17 
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to me prog rock / metal = Kansas, Rush, Marillion, Dream Theater, Pain of Salvation, Fates Warning, Andromeda, Vanden Plas, Kansas, Saga, Ark, Symphony X, Spiral Architect, Spastik Ink, Styx, Tangerine Dream, Camel, The Alan Parson’s Project, Wolverine, Pendragon, Journey, Superior, Spock’s Beard, Atrox, Redemption, Zero Hour, Dreamscape, Ayreon, Queensrÿsche, Watchtower, Conception, Eldritch, Shadow Gallery, Royal Hunt, Cairo ....

to me, typical prog rock components = a lot of breaks, very multi technical hard to memorize rhythm , something you can't follow with your single metronome. sometimes it reaches the verge of jazz metal....lol.


I don't care about getting right or wrong. I am not the voice of reason.

Cheers!


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2009, 22:10 
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Well, progressive rock/metal arrangements often incorporated elements drawn from classical, jazz, and world music. It's a fusion genre.
Also it usually has lots of tempo changes. That's why it is progressive.

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Last edited by musicman on 23 Feb 2009, 22:21, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2009, 22:17 
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I agree.

some more prog rock bands coming to my mind : Emerson Lake and Palmer, King Crimson, Shora, Equus, Lana Lane, Asia, Genesis, Yes, Wishbone Ash and Reo Speedwagon

so much!!

the end. see you in another topic.


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2009, 23:01 
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See you there,i don't wanna believe that the dt topic will get a third page!! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2009, 00:00 
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Dutch wrote:
According to rmf919,the bands you mentioned above arent progressive(maybe only psychotic waltz)


For me, "progressive" music is something new. Something that I've never heard before. A lot of bands mentioned above were progressive in the past, but never moved on. I still like their music, even if they sound a little bit "old-fashioned" today.

Just my two cents, I hope, you understand what I mean... :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2009, 17:30 
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Someone has to do the dirty job (Mike Rowe?) of separating the literal meaning of the term progressive with the meaning it has nowadays as a plain descriptive music genre label. These two may occasionally coincide, but they're different in their springs.

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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 14 Mar 2010, 20:24 
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me thinks their last cd "Black clouds and silver linings" kicks ass. Maybe it's not all totally different from their old work, but it is one of their best work to date.
To hell with the Progressive rock bulls%^; i always wondered why ppl want to give a genre-name to bands or artists that really want to make fine music, not bound by any genre or laws....
it's like a group of atheists creating a church of their own imo...


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 18 Apr 2010, 21:24 
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Dream Theater is a big influence of mine and will always hold a place in my heart, even when they're music isn't as epic as something previous. My favorite records are I&W, Awake, and SFAM. In my opinion, SFAM was they're crowning achievement and am hopeful they will produce something that significant in the future. I can't get into FII or Train of Thought, but I enjoy Octavarium and Systematic Chaos as fun records to sit back and enjoy. I think Black Clouds was a bit of a let down when I first listened, but has grown on me, with Count of Tuscany being my favorite on the record.

I personally was excited when they signed with Roadrunner. Any prog band that can get that kind of exposure is thumbs up for me. It gives me hope that people are starting to like this genre of music again.


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 Post subject: Re: Dream Theater
PostPosted: 06 May 2010, 20:39 
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I listened the complete Images & Words album today (heard Pull Me Under sooo many times already, but never listened the entire album), but I thought it wasn't pure prog rock / metal... Especially track 3 (I thought it was Take The Time) sounded quite funk to me... :P
(Or am I saying really strange things now? :))

Black clouds and silver linings got very positive reviews (101 out of 100 in the biggest Dutch metal magazine, says it all! ;)), so I'll listen that tomorrow... :)


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